English below

U razgovoru sa Santiagom Zarateom, otkrivamo fascinantni svijet Civic Coding-a, očima iskusnog programera koji je svoju strast prema tehnologiji usmjerio na poboljšanje društva. Kroz iskrene odgovore saznajte kako se definira i primjenjuje "civic coding", koja je važnost Open Source softvera u današnjem digitalnom dobu, te kako ove tehnologije oblikuju naš svakodnevni život. Naš sugovornik dijeli svoja iskustva s ključnim projektima, izazovima u Open Source zajednici, i daje dragocjene savjete mladim programerima. Santiago će biti predavač i mentor polaznicima i polaznicama programa Civic Coding, prve Helem Nejse Talent Akademije. 

"Civic coding" je termin koji može zvučati nepoznato ili nejasno ljudima izvan profesije. Kako ga objašnjavate sebi i kako biste ga opisali drugima? 

Meni je također bio nepoznat dok nisam upoznao svoju sadašnju suprugu Annu Kuliberdu. Kroz naše razgovore sam otkrio da sam uvijek na neki način bio uključen u to i znao sam o tome kroz Open Data Open Government ili Hacktivism. Civic coding bih opisao kao korištenje procesa i tehnologije za dobrobit društva, stvaranje alata uzimajući u obzir ljude koji će koristiti te alate, transparentnost i utjecaj tih alata na prostor u kojem djeluju. Ne možete očekivati da ljudi koriste vaš novi revolucionarni mobilni sistem plaćanja u okviru digitalnih rješenja za vladu, ako ljudi kojima je namijenjen uopće nemaju mobilne uređaje, za početak.

Koju ulogu igraju Open Source softveri u današnjem digitalnom dobu i zašto su važni za razvoj digitalne zajednice i društva u cjelini?

Više od Open Source softvera, rekao bih da zajednice koje rade i žive oko Open Source-a igraju veliku ulogu u našem svakodnevnom životu. Čuli ste za Wikipediju? Izgrađena na MediaWiki, ne samo da imaju masivnu enciklopediju, već i osnažuju druge da kreiraju svoje stranice na Wikipediji. Mozilla Foundation i EFF (između ostalih) rade s donosiocima politika kako bi održali naš internet našim. Mozilla ne samao da stoji iza Firefox browsera, već finansira i pomaže u osnivanju projekata kao što je LetsEncrypt. U digitalnom dobu, slobodne i open source zajednice i projekti pomažu nam da se dalje razvijamo kao društvo, dočekuju nove suradnike, čine svoje znanje i softver ili hardver dostupnim kako bi ga drugi mogli koristiti, pregledati, poboljšati i redistribuirati. Web je danas ono što jeste zahvaljujući slobodnom i open source softveru (FOSS): od programskih jezika do softvera za mapiranje i velikih umova koji su odlučili da ih izgrade.

Koji poznate Open Source softvere koristimo vrlo često, a da toga možda nismo ni svjesni?

Najbolji primjer takvog softvera je Wikipedia koja također ima zajednicu volontera koji je uređuju više puta dnevno, održavajući je ažurnom na najrelevantnijim mjestima, ali i preglednom! Svijet je izgrađen na bibliotekama poput OpenSSL i Curl koje nam omogućavaju da slušamo muziku putem streaming platformi, gledamo videozapise, pa čak i idemo na Mjesec ili objavljujemo TikTok video. Veoma je vjerovatno da vaš pružatelj e-mail usluga koristi FOSS za rad, pa čak i ako su izgradili svoj vlastiti softver, baziran je na otvorenim standardima (poznatim kao RFC). Još jedan odličan primjer su telefoni bazirani na Androidu.

Koji od projekata na kojima ste radili smatrate posebno važnim za zajednicu? Na koji način je taj projekt doprinio društvenom boljitku?

Najviše doprinosim openSUSE projektu, Ubuntu projektu te sam radio na PostgreSQL projektu u prošlosti. Trenutno radim za SUSE, kompaniju koja distribuira Linux, ali je također povezana s openSUSE projektom. Jedan od mojih glavnih doprinosa je vođenje tima Quality Engineers (testera) koji rade na poboljšanju kvalitete naše distribucije te prijavljivanju grešaka koje se pronađu na upstream softveru (gdje se nalaze stvarni programeri). Sarađujemo s GNUHealth projektom, na primjer, softverom za upravljanje bolničkim i pacijentovim zapisima koristeći openSUSE. Kada govorimo o SUSE-u, naši sistemi su implementirani na različitim mjestima, od PoS sistema do željeznica i automobila. Sve to razvijamo otvoreno u suradnji s mnogim drugim programerima a zahvaljujući otvorenoj prirodi softvera.

Koje su najveće prepreke i izazovi s kojima ste se suočili radeći na slobodnim i open source projektima? Kako ste ih prevazišli?

Ovo nije lako pitanje; najveći izazov koji sam pronašao je održavanje zamaha. Ljudi dolaze i odlaze i, budući da za mnoge od nas ima puno volonterskog rada, ponekad život stane na put i nema puno vremena za rad na određenom problemu. Kako bih to prevazišao, počeo sam razmišljati i gledati aktivnosti na nivou sedmica i mjeseci, kako ne bih izgubio nadu da će se nešto uraditi. Problem je i osjećaj korisnika da imaju pravo na nešto. Često korisnici zahtijevaju funkcije i ponekad njihovi upiti dolaze kao zahtjev, a ne kao molba. Veliki broj programera nije plaćeno plaćeni za rad na Open Source-u (mislim da sam jedan od rijetkih sretnika). Ipak, mi kao programeri nastojimo što pažljivije slušati naše korisnike, jer bez njih nema zajednice. Općenito, emocionalna inteligencija, učenje davanja i primanja povratnih informacija su glavni alati koje imam na raspolaganju, zatim dolazi volja za radom i ponekad debela koža za procesuiranje oštrijih povratnih informacija. Ljudi su najveći izazov. Zvat ću vas kada budem imao bolji odgovor kako to prevazići. Ali, kako moja supruga kaže: mi smo ljudi, ne roboti.

Kako vidite budućnost Open Source tehnologije u globalnom kontekstu? Koje potencijalne pravce razvoja predviđate i kakav bi uticaj mogli imati na tehnološki napredak i društvene promjene?

Vidim rast u Open Source istraživačkim zajednicama i zajednicama za provjeru činjenica. Rakođer imamo ovu stvar zvanu LLM-ove (Large Language Models) ili AI ako želite da iskoristim tu popularnu frazu. Vidim ljude kako traže više transparentnosti, odgovornosti od svojih vlada i entiteta, ljude koji koriste etičke open source modele za svoje projekte s AI, veću suradnju među zajednicama i veću svjesnost o tome kako internet funkcioniše (prije nekoliko godina "algoritam" nije bila tema koje se slučajno pokreće za večerom).

Koji bi bio vaš ključni savjet za mlade programere koji se žele uključiti u Open Source zajednicu? Koji pristup i vještine su najvažniji za njihov uspjeh?

Istražujte open source zajednice u 2000-im godinama, prije Wikipedije 2001. i čak prije Internet Archive-a. Godinama sam doprinosio opet source zajednicama bez pisanja koda. I još uvijek to radim na mnogo načina, što je sjajna stvar kod naših zajednica. Postoji prostor za vas da zasijate i surađujete, dobijete mentorstvo i prijateljstvo. Glavni savjet? Pitajte, budite znatiželjni, budite odgovorni, budite hrabri. Većina zajednica će biti spremna mentorirati ili voditi nove saradnike, pa pronađite projekt koji vam je blizak srcu, bilo da se radi o poljoprivredi ili postajanju digitalnim bibliotekarom. Također možete pročitati moj članak na LinkedIn-u o tome.

Na Helem Nejse Talent Academy ćete biti mentor učesnicima programa Civic Coding i raditi s njima kontinuirano sedam dana. Šta učesnici mogu očekivati od učenja i kako će to uticati na njihov profesionalni put?

Ako mogu sanjati, mogu to i napraviti. Pružiću znanje i smjernice te u određenoj mjeri im pokazati kako izgraditi potrebne vještine da postanu haktivisti ili suradnici na projektima. Iako ne mogu prenijeti sve svoje znanje za jednu sedmicu, nadam se da ću im moći pružiti alate i znanja dovoljna da započnu svoj vlastiti put i rastu zahvaljujući open source-u.

What is "Civic Coding" and how does it contribute to a better society?

In a conversation with Santiago Zarate, we discover the fascinating world of Civic Coding, through the eyes of an experienced programmer who has turned his passion for technology to improving society. Through honest answers, find out how "civic coding" is defined and applied, what is the importance of Open Source software in today's digital age, and how these technologies shape our everyday lives. Our interlocutor shares his experiences with key projects, challenges in the Open Source community, and gives valuable advice to young developers. Santiago will be a lecturer and mentor to participants of the Civic Coding program, the first Helem Nejse Talent Academy.

"Civic coding" is a term that may sound unfamiliar or unclear to people outside the profession. How do you explain it to yourself and how would you describe it to others?

He was also unknown to me until I met my current wife, Anna Kuliberda. Through our conversations I discovered that I have always been involved in it in some way and I knew about it through Open Data Open Government or Hacktivism. I would describe civic coding as the use of processes and technology for the benefit of society, the creation of tools taking into account the people who will use those tools, the transparency and impact of those tools on the space in which they operate. You can't expect people to use your new revolutionary mobile payment system within digital solutions for government if the people it's intended for don't even have mobile devices to begin with.

What role do Open Source software play in today's digital age and why are they important for the development of the digital community and society as a whole?

More than Open Source software, I would say that the communities that work and live around Open Source play a big role in our daily lives. Heard of Wikipedia? Built on MediaWiki, they not only have a massive encyclopedia, but also empower others to create their own Wikipedia pages. The Mozilla Foundation and the EFF (among others) are working with policymakers to keep our Internet ours. Mozilla not only stands behind the Firefox browser, but also finances and helps to establish projects such as LetsEncrypt. In the digital age, free and open source communities and projects help us to further develop as a society, welcome new contributors, make their knowledge and software or hardware available for others to use, review, improve and redistribute. The web is what it is today thanks to free and open source software (FOSS): from programming languages ​​to mapping software and the great minds who decided to build them.

Which well-known Open Source software do we use very often, without perhaps even realizing it?

The best example of such software is Wikipedia, which also has a community of volunteers who edit it several times a day, keeping it up-to-date in the most relevant places, but also transparent! The world is built on libraries like OpenSSL and Curl that allow us to listen to music through streaming platforms, watch videos, and even go to the moon or post a TikTok video. It's very likely that your email service provider uses FOSS to work, and even if they've built their own software, it's based on open standards (known as RFCs). Another great example are phones based on Android.

Which of the projects you worked on do you consider particularly important for the community? In what way did that project contribute to social betterment?

I mostly contribute to the openSUSE project, the Ubuntu project and have worked on the PostgreSQL project in the past. I currently work for SUSE, a company that distributes Linux but is also affiliated with the openSUSE project. One of my main contributions is leading a team of Quality Engineers (testers) who work to improve the quality of our distribution and report bugs found on the upstream software (where the actual developers are). We collaborate with the GNUHealth project, for example, on hospital and patient record management software using openSUSE. When we talk about SUSE, our systems are deployed in different places, from PoS systems to railways and automobiles. We develop all this openly in cooperation with many other developers and thanks to the open nature of the software.

What are the biggest obstacles and challenges you have faced while working on free and open source projects? How did you overcome them?

This is not an easy question; the biggest challenge I've found is maintaining momentum. People come and go and, because there is a lot of volunteer work for many of us, sometimes life gets in the way and there isn't much time to work on a particular problem. In order to overcome this, I started to think and look at activities at the level of weeks and months, so as not to lose hope that something will be done. The user's feeling that they are entitled to something is also a problem. Often users request features and sometimes their queries come as a request rather than a request. A large number of developers are not paid a living for working on Open Source (I think I'm one of the lucky few). However, we as developers try to listen to our users as carefully as possible, because without them there is no community. In general, emotional intelligence, learning to give and receive feedback are the main tools I have at my disposal, then comes the will to work and sometimes a thick skin to process harsher feedback. People are the biggest challenge. I will call you when I have a better answer on how to overcome this. But, as my wife says: we are people, not robots.

How do you see the future of Open Source technology in a global context? What potential directions of development do you foresee and what impact could they have on technological progress and social changes?

I see growth in the Open Source research and fact-checking communities. We even have this thing called LLMs (Large Language Models) or AI if you want to use that popular phrase. I see people demanding more transparency, accountability from their governments and entities, people using ethical open source models for their AI projects, more collaboration between communities and more awareness of how the internet works (a few years ago "algorithm" was not a topic that is accidentally started at dinner).

What would be your key piece of advice for young developers who want to get involved in the Open Source community? What approach and skills are most important to their success?

Explore open source communities in the 2000s, before Wikipedia in 2001, and even before the Internet Archive. I've been contributing to re-source communities for years without writing code. And I still do in many ways, which is the great thing about our communities. There is space for you to sow and collaborate, get mentorship and friendship. Top tip? Ask, be curious, be responsible, be brave. Most communities will be willing to mentor or guide new contributors, so find a project that's close to your heart, whether it's farming or becoming a digital librarian. You can also read my article on LinkedIn about it.

At the Helem Nejse Talent Academy, you will be a mentor to the participants of the Civic Coding program and work with them continuously for seven days. What can participants expect from learning and how will it affect their professional path?

If I can dream it, I can do it. I will provide knowledge and guidance and to some extent show them how to build the necessary skills to become hacktivists or project collaborators. Although I cannot impart all my knowledge in one week, I hope to be able to provide them with the tools and knowledge enough to start their own journey and grow thanks to open source.